GM/Chevy/Pontiac/Buick, etc.

[Jag67]

discuss!!

[LazarusFan]

There's rumors GM might get rid of another part of the chain.:o  Hopefully not Buick.  I want to get a Buick when I get older.

Don't forget Hummer and Saab.  They're also owned by GM.

[Zayre88]

I think they are gonna trim the brands they already have.  

If it was me, i would stop making the Buick Terraza van and the Rainier SUV wich are former Olds with a few Buick touch-ups.  Plus, the Rendezvous can do the job of both.

I'd stop the Grand Am and Sunfire now.  They already have the new G6 and Pursuit so why keep the old cars longer?

I would also remove the Montana from Pontiac and move it to Chevrolet to replace the Uplander.  And stop making the Aztek.  The Vibe and the Torrent will do the job.

I would also phase out Chevy Trucks and keep GMC only.  This is truly ridiculous having the same trucks on two brand names to market...!  Only GM can do this.

[HoJofan206]

I see it very pointless for GM to carry on the Saturn brand.

Most of the vehicles are just re-badged GM products.
Since the Saturn Ion sold so horribly, they just changed the front and rear end a bit and call it a Chevy Cobalt.

GM better get their act together before they run themselves out of the market.

[HoJofan206]

Pontiac seems to have a lot of pointless cars in their lineup.

The Sunfire is FINALLY gone after the 2005 model year.
The new GTO.  Its just a re-badged car brought over from Europe, yet another bad idea from GM.
The Pontiac Aztek....WHY is this vehicle still being produced.
Each year GM complains about how few of these hideous things they sell.
The Vibe, just a re-badged Toyota....so why not buy the Toyota Matrix and get the bonus of a higher resale value??
The Bonneville and Grand Prix have the same ol look that the Pontiac's have had for years........:no:

[Jag67]

My dad has an Aztec and I must admit they are unusual cars. And no, they don't make them anymore. Production stopped in November of last year. They were built in Mexico too!!!

[HoJofan206]

I am glad the Aztek has been discontinued.  I cant immage why anyone would ever buy one of those things.  I would be embarrassed to be see seen getting out of one of those things.  IT would have been great in the 1983 movie, "Vacation"

[Jag67]

I know But when I step out of my dad's Aztec, I'm saying "HEY!!! I'M UNUSUAL!!!"

[tokensafari]

I'm not a fan of GM products! It's pointless for car makers to manufacture the same two cars and put two different name plates on it. . GM is notorious for that! Stupid GM

[Jag67]

Ya, but Ford and Chrysler do it just as much. Look at the Chrysler vans and ford's crown Victoria!!

[Zayre88]

Originally posted by tokensafari
I'm not a fan of GM products! It's pointless for car makers to manufacture the same two cars and put two different name plates on it. . GM is notorious for that! Stupid GM

I agree, GM is wasting time and money to market cars under too many brands, they have 3 vans with almost the same style.  GMC Trucks and Chevy trucks are the same.  The Chevy Equinox and Pontiac Torrent are the same.  The Cobalt is identical to the Pursuit, only the front grille is different.

Around here, they also sell the Chevy Epica wich is a former Daewoo (also sold as the Suzuki Verona) turned into a Chevy.  And they sell the Malibu in the same category !!!!!  Only GM can do that.:mad:

[HoJofan206]

Way back in the day Buick started out (when purchased by GM) as the second "luxury" car brand along with Cadilliac.  They never really caught on and then moved into the "also sold" cataogory with Pontiac/Chevy/Olds.  Then when that was no longer working they became the "older crowd" car.
NOW they are trying to lure in younger buyers.  Younger buyers DONT want a Buick.

[Zayre88]

Originally posted by 76BraldorZayKamesfanBBTB
Heh they'd might want a Buick if Buick made a newer version of the 1986 Wildcat!


BUT NOOOOOO THEY HAD TO MAKE A BAD VERSION OF THE 1998 TAURAUS THE LACROSS

The Lacross I believe replaced another Buick

dang it its not the Lesabre What vehicle was it?

It replaces the Regal wich still has the same style it had in 1997...  Only GM makes a style last 8 years, 9 if you add the year the company came with the design, maybe 10.....

[Zayre88]

Once again, a great GM mistake... the Achieva.  The car that was supposed to be the begining of a new era for Oldsmobile...   What were they thinking!!  The front end was inspired by 70's Olds.  Again, a boring car that kept it's style from 1992 to 1998. The Alero was introduced in 1999, but too late.

[HoJofan206]

If you ask me Pontiac has made some major mistakes over the past few years.  First they discontinue the Firebird.  That one the ONE Pontiac that didnt look like all the other (cars) that they offered.  Now the have discontinued the plastic glad Grand Am....the best selling vehicle in the Pontiac lineup.
They brought the GTO name back to fill the void left by the Firebird, but this car is literally just a Mondeo brought over from Europe.  Did GM not learn from that mistake with the Catera?  The "Caddy that Zigs".  Bringing a rebadged car over from Europe does not fool American Shoppers.  Even GM buyers know the different.  So far the Grand Am replacement called the G6 has had sluggish sales, causing GM/Pontiac to shrug shoulders yet again for the second time in 3 model years.  Pontiac just might put themselves out of business with all of these "great" new car models.

[Jag67]

Why the flip would Pontiac kill the Grand Am??? That's probably Pontiac's best-known car!!! No wonder GM is in so much doodoo.

[C. Fontaine]

This is a repost from the crappy car model thread but, I heard on the news last week that GM is cutting 25,000 jobs and closing 9 plants due to it's first non-profitable year, or something along those lines. An expert they had on the radio with them said their problem is that they have upwards of 90 car makes and models to crank out, while their competitors like Ford and such have nowhere near that amount, and that they should start cutting back on production of more low-selling models rather than closing factories, like you guys are saying.

[HoJofan206]

I think we will see many vehicle nameplates dropped form several of the GM line ups if what is said about closing 9 factories is true.

[C. Fontaine]

Here is the article I saw on FOX News.

[HoJofan206]

Article about what on FOX news?

[C. Fontaine]

My last post is a link, sorry.  Here is the text from it.



GM to Cut 25,000 Jobs, Close Plants
Wednesday, June 08, 2005

General Motors Corp. (GM) plans to eliminate 25,000 jobs in the United States in the next few years by closing additional plants, as it battles high costs and shrinking market share, the company's chief executive said Tuesday part.

Speaking to shareholders at GM's 96th annual shareholder meeting in Delaware Tuesday morning, Chairman and Chief Executive Rick Wagoner (search) said the capacity and job cuts will generate annual savings of roughly $2.5 billion.

Wagoner said at least 25,000 U.S. jobs would likely be cut in the period 2005-2008, from an hourly work force that stood at 111,000 at the end of 2004.

The world's largest automaker has been closing and idling plants over the past four years, reducing its annual assembly capacity from six million vehicles in 2002 to five million by the end of this year.

GM shares gained 31 cents to close at $30.73 on the New York Stock Exchange (search) after rising as high as $31.16 earlier in the session. GM's shares have tumbled to their lowest price in more than a decade, and Fitch Ratings and Standard and Poor's Ratings Services both reduced the company's bond rating to "junk" status last month.

The GM job cut announcement was the biggest in the United States since Kmart (search) unveiled plans to cut 37,000 jobs in January 2003, according to John Challenger of outplacement firm Challenger, Gray and Christmas Inc.

"This may not be the last major job cut announcement we see this year as other companies, including other American automakers, struggle to make a profit amid escalating health-care costs, not to mention the cost of providing ongoing health benefits to growing ranks of retirees," Challenger said in a statement.

Analyst Michael Bruynesteyn of Prudential Equity Group said eliminating 25,000 or more hourly jobs through 2008 would only be in line with the normal 5 percent annual retirement or attrition rate at GM.

"These plans are not surprising given market share losses and efficiency gains but we do not think they should be viewed as a new strategy," added Goldman Sachs analyst Robert Barry.

"If market share continues to fall over time, as we expect, then GM is really just treading water with such actions, not boosting profitability."

Wagoner focused on priorities for clarifying the role of each of GM's eight brands, intensifying efforts to reduce cost and improve quality and continuing to search for ways to reduce skyrocketing health care costs.

He noted that the company's current $1,500 per worker health-care expense puts GM at a "significant disadvantage versus foreign-based competitors," and said GM has conducted "intense discussions" with the unions about how to reduce health-care costs.

Billionaire investor Kirk Kerkorian's (search) offer to purchase 28 million GM shares at $31 apiece, boosting his stake to about 9 percent from 4 percent, expires later today.

It was not immediately known which GM plants would be closed. GM has already closed several facilities this year. The company shut a factory in Linden, N.J., in April and a factory in Baltimore in May, affecting around 2,000 employees. The company also closed two plants in Lansing, Mich., last month, although those 3,500 employees are expected to find work at other GM facilities in the city.

"Let me say up front that our absolute top priority is to get our largest business unit back to profitability as soon as possible," Wagoner said.

Part of that bid involves negotiating with the United Auto Workers (search) and other unions, discussions that are ongoing.

Wagoner said the talks, which he described as intense, have focused on a cooperative approach to significantly reduce GM's health care costs. GM's health care tab for its 1.1 million current and former workers and their families is more than $5 billion a year and rising.

"We have not reached an agreement at this time, and to be honest, I'm not 100 percent that we will," Wagoner said of the ongoing talks with its unions. "But all parties are working hard on it, in the spirit of addressing a huge risk to our collective futures while providing greater security and good benefits for our employees."

To date, the UAW has indicated it won't reopen its contract, which expires in 2007, and agree to pick up a larger share of soaring health care costs.

Aside from growing health care and pension costs, GM has had lackluster sales lately of its highly profitable trucks and sport utility vehicles, which have been hurt by high fuel prices.

GM's sales were down 5 percent in the first five months of the year, and the automaker reported a $1.1 billion loss in the first quarter.

Reuters and the Associated Press contributed to this report.

[tokensafari]

They're too bloated!

[HoJofan206]

GM does need to cut back and get back to basics. Building a few cars the right way instead of building lots of cars the mediocre way.

[tokensafari]

Buick Really doesn't exist much anymore. It's kind of Like Mercury with Ford. With Pontiac being revived and hyped up by GM, i don't see much happening with Buick either. GM's top 3 brands would be Cadillac, Chevy, and probably Pontiac.

[Zayre88]

Originally posted by HoJofan206
If you ask me Pontiac has made some major mistakes over the past few years.  First they discontinue the Firebird.  That one the ONE Pontiac that didnt look like all the other (cars) that they offered.  Now the have discontinued the plastic glad Grand Am....the best selling vehicle in the Pontiac lineup.
They brought the GTO name back to fill the void left by the Firebird, but this car is literally just a Mondeo brought over from Europe.  Did GM not learn from that mistake with the Catera?  The "Caddy that Zigs".  Bringing a rebadged car over from Europe does not fool American Shoppers.  Even GM buyers know the different.  So far the Grand Am replacement called the G6 has had sluggish sales, causing GM/Pontiac to shrug shoulders yet again for the second time in 3 model years.  Pontiac just might put themselves out of business with all of these "great" new car models.

GM makes me angry, they are totally lost and they do stupid things.  The re-badged Holden Monaro is a cheap way to reintroduce the GTO in the Pontiac lineup. The car already looks outdated...  The G6 looks fine but it came too late, the Grand Am had the same style from 1999 to 2004 and they are still available in 2005.  Than means they came up with that design in 1998 and 8 years later the car is still the same.   Why does GM can't stop selling it's older cars when they introduce a replacement model ??  Are they the only car company that does that?

The Grand Am, Sunfire, Montana, Century, Venture, Cavalier are still available even though the G6, Pursuit, MontanaSV6, LaCrosse, Uplander and Cobalt are supposed to replace the older models...  You look at a brochure and they seem to have a whole lot of cars but half of them are phased out model still on sale...  :boring:

Another bad move, dropping the Camaro/Firebird.  GM is too lazy and don't know how to go on with these legendary cars, they let the Mustang have all the market.

I still don't understand why they are keeping the old Blazer SUV while they already have the more modern Trailblazer/Envoy/Rainier available plus the smaller Equinox/Torrent and other Saturn/Cadillac SUV...

They should phase out Saturn and GMC now and focus their attention on the other brands...

And why is the Oldsmobile website is still online with 2004 retail prices and advertising about Olds cars ???!!!  You can locate a dealer, build your Olds, and more...

[HoJofan206]

I pretty much agree with you.  Saturn needs to go by the way side.  It was supposed to be "A different kind of company" as they said, but all they are are yet another rebadged GM product.  At some point one would think the GM execs would figure out that the American car buyers have figured this out and are clearly not buying the rebadged idea.  One only needs to look so far as Plymouth and/or Oldsmobile.

I would cut Saturn and Saab from the lineup first.

[store215]

Originally posted by HoJofan206
I pretty much agree with you.  Saturn needs to go by the way side.  It was supposed to be "A different kind of company" as they said, but all they are are yet another rebadged GM product.  At some point one would think the GM execs would figure out that the American car buyers have figured this out and are clearly not buying the rebadged idea.  One only needs to look so far as Plymouth and/or Oldsmobile.

I would cut Saturn and Saab from the lineup first.

Actually, many new GM cars are actually using parts of Saturns in their other cars.

Chevy Cobalt is pretty much the same as the Saturn Ion.

And The Saturn Ion is pretty "unique" because it uses a Honda engine.

I really don't know where Saab fits in with them though either...I havent seen anyone driving a Saab in a long time.

And GM just extended their employee discount thing until the end of September...they are afraid they will lose money once they drop the program.

[HoJofan206]

I read somewhere last year where the new Cobalt was derived from the Saturn Ion because GM had spent quite a bit of money on building/producing the Ion and they sold very few, so GM did what they do best, rebadged the car and now we have the Chevy Cobalt.  I dont think the Cobalt sales are that of what were the aging Cavalier.

[HoJofan206]

The 1984 Buick Skyhawk.

[HoJofan206]

The 1985 Chevy Spectrum.  I believe this car was nothing more than a rebadged Isuzu.